League Of Losers

CapnTthePirateG · Post by **CapnTthePirateG** » Tue Jun 18, 2013 2:03 am

RIP poor Kha.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Wed Jun 19, 2013 2:29 pm

Kha is still awesome, he just doesn't spam waveclear anymore. He got buffed in the most recent patch for no reason at all.

Has anyone had the pleasure of going up against a proxy farming Singed or Tryndamere yet? I've gotten to play against them as a jungler and mid before (and they typically gave me a lot of free gold by doing it), but I never realized just how hard it was to deal with as a top laner.

I went Irelia vs a Singed who, come level 6, went behind my outer turret and farmed, leaving me to tank waves or chase him around (while he cleared the wave anyways) and miss my own wave for a potential kill. Even with a few ganks Singed went up on farm against me (teleport ghost Singed) and even got our top outer turret when my team went for a dragon.

In spite of him dying 6 times in the lane phase he was the strongest person on the enemy team because he didn't miss a CS after 6 (and was Singed). I'm sure our comp was kind of weak against proxy farming (Vi isn't that great at ganking Singed, and Irelia has trouble sticking to him when he ults or ghosts even with botrk and mallet), but damn it sucked all the fun out of the game.

Every team fight before the final push was 4v5 because we'd only engage after we'd killed Singed or when he was farming top, so there was never a question of if we'd win them, and it was never a question of IF top turret would go down, but a matter of when. Killing him didn't even feel good because it was free kills that took so long it almost wasn't worth it (especially after the first few times).

Fuck proxy farming. I haven't seen it win yet, but it makes for the most boring games ever.

Korgan0 · Post by **Korgan0** » Wed Jun 19, 2013 5:57 pm

What I've heard is a good idea is to buy a Mejai's or a Sword of the Occult and use the proxier to farm stacks.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:20 pm

Hah, that'd be pretty fun if they did the old "die as often as possible" proxy that you sometimes see. I'm thinking a Fiddle or AD caster where you get SotO/Mejai's as your only offensive item and go straight tank while farming the proxy until they cut it out.

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Thu Jun 20, 2013 9:46 am

Jungler and top or mid buy sword/mejai and jungle camps the top/mid river. Singed burns his ult in an attempt to proxy, then jungle ganks while he goes b or kills him if he doesn't. I have the pleasure of seeing proxy singed in my normals and when I smurfed last week and any earlygame coordination leaves him in the dust.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:31 pm

Just had one of those games where you do really well and your team just does as shitty as possible to make up for it.

Long ass post:

Ending a game 11-3-3 with a loss when being capable of carrying fights feels bad. It's not like I got the kills late game as they threw or in my own lane either, I ganked bot repeatedly from mid for kills and got us the first dragon, the team was just awful at following anything up and our AD managed to die first every fight. I had a bad feeling after we stole red and Lee managed to die during his level 2 gank of a level 1 bot lane (with his own Doran's as a start for gank power), but holy shit. I didn't expect the game to go as badly as it did.

At one point Lee Sin went to their blue when none of them were in vision on the map, ward jumped in (instead of Q, so there goes his escape), stole blue, and died.

On the plus side, I was on a pretty long win streak before that loss and only lost 4 LP. That was also one of the best scores I've had on Brand at platinum, so it was still a fun game. I could 1v1 pretty much anyone, turned around a bot lane that was losing severely on my own, and the end of the game was much closer than the beginning where every lane was getting stomped (not that we stopped getting stomped, but our team fight power was decent even though our Jax was kind of retarded).

The last push was actually a close fight. We fought at our red (purple side red) and I dropped low to Viktor's ult (and dropped him low as well) before I got into position in the camp itself, safe from their non-gap closing team, and was throwing out spells safely. The fight was going well until Garen ran at our Varus, so Lee kicked him over the wall... into red camp, right next to me. I slowed him and ran into the brush at red, killed their Viktor and then died immediately because I was put so far out of position as our team fell apart without my damage and CC. Would we have won the fight if Lee didn't Garen-tee my own death? Maybe not. But did we definitely lose it when he killed the strongest person on our team for them? Yes.

End rant.

Moral of the story: Solo queue can be fucked up no matter what, and you can carry at least one failing lane and a jungler if you believe in yourself (and are an AoE murder machine). Two lanes...I'm not good enough to do that yet.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:34 pm

I just played my last game at level 19. I should be level 20. I was like 5 XP away, and I had a pretty decent bank of IP saved up for runes.

So what the fuck happens? The game lags out after I finish before going to the scoring screen. And then... I can't fucking connect back into the game. They have a website that tells you if the server is down. That website is down.

I assume the server is down, but I don't know. Meanwhile, now I can't buy my fucking Runes until god knows when.

Fuck.

CapnTthePirateG · Post by **CapnTthePirateG** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:00 am

My RL friends and I have been complaining about the lag spikes. Maybe they're finally fixing them.

Snicker.

Korgan0 · Post by **Korgan0** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:16 pm

It's incredibly refreshing to hear about these kinds of horrible players in Platinum.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:11 pm

At plat everyone has fairly good execution, map awareness, tenacity (not the stat), and rarely trolls (the exception being if they're diamond V, then they always troll). The thing is that's pretty much the worst you can be and still be plat (unless you're plat V, in which case you're just a lucky Gold I player who can't fall).

The main difference between plat players and diamond seems to be decision making and general dickheadedness, whereas the difference between players in other leagues varies a lot. I have friends stuck in silver because they don't know how to carry when they get fed, don't know what to do in team fights, can't CS well, don't understand how to build properly, can't make proper calls, etc.

Lee's game-ending kick was a fucking excellent kick from a mechanical point of view; he got Garen over a wall that isn't easy to kick people over in a hectic fight. It was just a stupid fucking kick because he wasn't paying attention to everyone's position in the fight.

Lee had shitty decision making, but his Lee mechanics were good. He landed lots of Qs and knew how to do his rotations, he was just an idiot.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:52 pm

The weird thing is too that, in most games, that kick would have actually been a really fucking good call -- exceptional peel for the AD carry.

Too bad that, in this case, it wasn't the AD carry that was doing the carrying and needed the peel.

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:48 pm

So heimer and yorick are now getting reworks. This makes me incredibly happy.

Korgan0 · Post by **Korgan0** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:02 pm

I don't lane against Yorick very often, but I usually just get my shit kicked in thanks to his absurd poke and sustain.

So, I play a lot of Ryze, and lately I've been running into trouble with my itemization. I start charm+wards+pots or sapph+pots, depending on their team, rush a tear, get an RoA, then either an FH or an Archangels' depending on what I feel like, then get the other item, then finish off with a Void Staff if they have a lot of MR and I need damage, or a Bveil/Warmog's/Thornmail/whatever. This build works just fine in basically every circumstance, with the single exception that if I need to itemize against magic damage mid-game, the FH does nothing. So, I've been trying to figure out a replacement for FH that gives me the 20% CDR I need along with the MR. The two candidates I can think of are Spirit Visage and Athene's- the passive on SV isn't gonna be very useful given the palty spellvamp ryze has, and neither the unique passives on Athene's or the AP are going to be super useful on Ryze. Any thoughts?

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:51 am

Unfortunately, you've hit upon a well-known and big hole in MR itemization in the game. This hole may or may not be intentional.

A blue potion can work for CDR at times. You'll see Kennens in pro games have one up in almost all fights.

Lokathor · Post by **Lokathor** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 6:55 am

Got into Bronze 1 during placement.

Lost 20 games in a row, dropped to Bronze 5.

Can't win enough games in a row to get even 75 LP.

Classic tale.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:30 am

Is there a time denners would want to get together to play?

Every once in a while I see one or two people on, but not regularly.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:46 am

I see you on more than anyone else. I can play at a lot of times, but I don't think anyone wants to, since I am not yet level 30.

But since we are talking about the hypothetical Den team, what is everyone's favorite role? I have taken to jungling a lot, just because it is usually the unfilled roll at level 20. Not to say I am particularly good at it, but that is what I do.

I have never played Top ever even once, because literally every single game someone wants top.

I have a smurf account where I Jungle Xin Zhao at level 5 and generally keep up, so I am thinking about getting him on my main to jungle with.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:12 am

I pretty much only jungle. In the very rare circumstance that someone else ahead of me takes jungle, I'll play top.

Lokathor · Post by **Lokathor** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 11:07 am

I'm Lokathor on LoL same as here.

I usually play support lately, but I've been trying to branch out because support can't really turn around a bad team as much as another role can. Super hard to ever get out of Solo/Duo Bronze League as support.

Korgan0 · Post by **Korgan0** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:54 pm

I'm best at support or mid, since the champions i'm best at mechanically are probably Ryze and Sona, but I play a decent Darius, Jax, Rammus, Tristana, and Maokai. I also just bought Thresh, since I want to diversify my support roster. I've played with Surgo a couple of times, and he can speak to the fact that even on those champs I'm not exactly great. If I'm on, though, feel free to hit me up for a game or two.

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 8:46 pm

Support all day with sides of jungle and (terrible) adc. If anyone ever picks me top I just go singed.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Fri Jul 05, 2013 2:15 pm

I'm in Silver V. I win most consistently running AD Carries-- Generally Ashe or Vayne. When I know who I'm picking into, I like running ranged AD top. I most frequently play Support though, because it's what's available. Nami is my favorite but I can run Fiddlesticks, Lulu, or really any ranged support. My old main role was AP Mid, and I still tend to win lane if I can run Viktor, Karma, or Ahri.

@Lokathor: What supports have you tried playing? I didn't have much trouble going from Bronze V to Bronze I playing support almost exclusively.Maybe Sona is a little too passive? If you're better than the other team, it's easy to rack up lots of kills on Nami or Zyra or Karma, and then carry your team like any other AP.

MGuy · Post by **MGuy** » Fri Jul 05, 2013 3:29 pm

I could seriously write a book on my habit both good and bad when playing League. Here we go with the real short version:

Top as Darius is the main thing I like to do. I will admit though, I can be pretty inconsistent with my results depending on who I am laning against. Typically ranged attackers with a stun/snare give me THE MOST trouble (Ryze, Elisa, even a Lux) but if it is any other type of person I 'usually' do well against them and usually do well for the rest of the game.

I also can adc fairly well (Draven, Trist, Jayce) and can be support if I can be Blitz or Thresh (usually they are banned in ranked so usually I don't play support in ranked).

I can only mid with Heimer or Jayce and achieve consistent and positive results.Everyone else (that I've tried in mid) seems to produce completely random results. Don't know why, that's just the rules for me apparently.

I just got ranked like a day or 2 ago and am in Silver IV so that's that.

Typically I'm a very aggressive player especially in the laning stages. I am quick to go defensive if we're losing though. I play Darius a lot so I'm pretty good at judging distances and timing hits. I am very lazy at setting up Runes and so I just have one rune page for all my heroes though I am thinking of making one specifically for Darius for some more armor pen and a small bit oh life steal for that early laning phase.

So far my troubles have been people refusing to allow me to have top, people leaving matches, and oddly enough people not responding to me at all when I say "I need help"*. Other than that I tend to do fair.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Fri Jul 05, 2013 4:49 pm

I haven't crunched the numbers on this, but I find it hard to believe ArmorPen would be better for Darius than flat AD. Flat AD Marks give you +8 AD, which translates into

+10 mixed damage per autoattack
+11 mixed damage per full hit Decimate
+11 mixed damage on Rank 1 Cripple
+6-12 true damage on Guillotine

EDIT: OOPS. The spoiler block is a mess of calculations I did on the value of 8 Armor Pen. That's basically irrelevant because it turns out that Armor Pen Marks give +12 Armor Pen. I take back everything, Armor Pen is actually really good.

Against targets with relatively low armor, armor penetration gives about +1% damage per point. For instance, against armor 40, 8 ArPen increases damage by 6.3% You would need around 165 AD to get the same benefit on autoattacks as the flat AD gets. Rank 5 Crippling strike gets +18 damage out of 8 AD, so you'd need 300 AD to make ArPen worth it. Your ultimate gets no benefit at all from Armor Pen. Your Axe Spin is the one place Armor Pen shines. Using rank 5 Decimate against 40 Armor, 8 Armor Pen gives you AT LEAST +19 damage, plus 6.5% of your bonus AD. That's really good, but I'm not sure it's worth the tradeoff.

The more Armor the enemy builds, the worse Armor Pen becomes. Darius is fortunate enough to be able to stack percentage Armor Pen. With Last Whisper, Apprehend, and Masteries, he can get 56% Armor Penetration! That means that the calculation about 40 Armor probably stays relevant all game against squishies, since he cuts 90 armor down to around 40. However, against tanks with ~200 armor, Armor Pen runes are going to distinctly underperform.

EDIT: If you add in Armor Pen Quints, then stacking ArPen is probably better than stacking flat AD. But I'm assuming you're using Lifesteal. (Or my personal favorite: flat health regen)

EDIT: For Ryze, why not just sit as a Negatron Cloak. A midgame Inventory could look like Tear/Catalyst/Negatron/Boots/Wards and still have one slot for parts of things in progress.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Fri Jul 05, 2013 5:48 pm

I think he's complaining about the lack of CDR, which is a legit problem -- otherwise the MR items available for Ryze (Banshee's Veil, Abyssal Scepter) are perfectly viable.